doronjosama | Say No to Moe!

Awesome. Thanks for posting this. I often wonder what people are thinking in Japan. I've been asking my friends who live there a lot of questions, to try and understand more of what their true cultural attitudes are.

We only see a small part of their culture here, and I'm all for de-mystifying it and getting people to accept that NO, not EVERYTHING in Japan is cool and amazing! They're just people with a slightly different way of life, just like everyone else!

It's a great article! Especially for me, because I've had to deal so often with people who want us to print lolicon or shotacon books at Radio, and they always say "well, in Japan EVERYONE LOVES LOLICON!" Like there are giant billboards of lolicon porn all over Tokyo or something, to advertise Coca-Cola or C.C. Lemon... But no, not everyone in Japan likes lolicon! Hooray!

And yeah, the fetishization of the Japanese culture/lifestyle is kind of goofy. It kills me to overhear anime fans at conventions talking about how someday, they're going to move to Japan, and become perfectly assimilated into their culture... and of course, they'll get jobs as animators or manga artists! Suuuuure, they will...

Daaaaaang, I wonder what impression this woman has of our American fans. The one that reside in the "deep end"

Having seen this culture first hand I have to agree with what she says. for the record. Say "Otaku" in any form to a japanese or Okinawain Person--Conversation Killer...

A woman after my own heart! She can go after the "moe" stuff, and I can keep on pointing out that just because American comics have been a locker room, is no reason for them to STAY that way.

And the whole thing about taking a middling hit and merching it to death? Hellloooooo, Dynamic Forces!

With the famous William Shatner speech, and this article, I wonder what those two people would do if all the fans really DID get a life? Who do they think buys tons of their stuff and shells out money for autographs at conventions? It ain't the average Joe Blow on the street who has a life-- it's the rabid fanboy. If all the fans suddenly got a life, they might find themselves with nothing but chirping crickets at their booths or signings.

Not that I'm disagreeing with the 'creep' factor in a lot of the hard-core fans, but to have the creators go out and deride the fanatical fans is kind of like sports players goofing on the sports fanatics and telling them to quit buying season tickets and team jerseys and go spend more time with their families.

The true value of being a real otaku lay in the belief that nobody else understands you.

It seems nothing can remain inscrutable in the face of opportunists, unfortunately. Her last sentence makes me believe that she's suffering the pain many of us feel when our favourite thing has finally reached the exploitation level.

-Rikki

I'm just more delighted that she's decrying a genre of anime and manga (and toys, and maid cafes, and hostess clubs, and video games) that celebrate the ideal of underage, passive, helpless, submissive girls. Having seen some "moe" anime and manga, it's pretty barf-inducing stuff, stuff clearly designed for guys who can't stomach the idea of actual women who might say no, or have opinions. It's more my feminist heart being warmed by Mimei's statements about that, than her obvious anger at various fanboys.

Oddly, I don't think her manga is aimed at the hardcore fanboys, from the cover it looks more like the kind of manga the average Japanese person reads on the train or something- or it's one of those new "hipster" manga, the kind that are made by and for super trendy young Japanese.

I know that feeling, boy do I ever. ^_^;

Haahaa, actually, I immediately thought of some of the weird items General Products made back in the day! ^_^;

Oh yeah, when my penpal visited, she jokingly referred to me as an otaku, but explained *very quickly* that she was kidding, because I didn't look like Poindexter or stay hidden in my room all the time. (This was a girl who was obsessed with classic Star Trek...) And our Japanese artists who are hardcore fans of anime and manga and science fiction make derogatory references to otaku, and insist they are NOT otaku. ^_^ It's pretty funny.

Oh, god, they will ALWAYS leap immediately to mind, but I was thinking of American analogues.

Indeed. In a lot of cases, there's a fair amount of "serial killer waiting to happen" in the Japanese interpretation of the word "otaku." It certainly isn't considered a compliment, in my experience.

Also, regarding the gaijin who want to go over to Japan and be assimilated: There's a saying in Japan -- "I was born in Japan. So were my father, and his father, and his grandfather before him. But my grandfather's grandfather was not. So I am a foreigner." In their case, usually a loud, socially graceless foreigner who speaks like a character in a cartoon aimed at 6-to-10 year olds... ^.^

I was trying to find the right words to express just that. And how...

It's nice to know that the Japanese feel the same as the rest of the world about the otaku culture!

Ditto..!!

Hmm...

HMM...

I'm not sure how to react to this...but I want to react, it bears a reaction. So uh, bear with me I guess. Rambling ahead:

First off, the whole Densha Otoko thing amuses me. I love Densha Otoko (Well the TV Show), but not because the geek got the girl (okay it's nice) but more because the forum goers are hilarious. I understand it's a "hyper reality" where everything is a cliche and not a fair representation of reality.

Secondly, I don't get the "spectacles" remark. I think glasses make a girl sexy. But I mean girls that are 18+ The loli thing yeah, that's pretty wrong.

Third, I don't understand the allure of maid cafes the same way I don't understand the allure of "Hooters" or strip clubs. My friends took me to a topless bar for my 18th Birthday so I can say I've actually been but I didn't see the point. Hell (and lord this shows how much of a geek I am) Cyclops put it best speaking to an exotic dancer in one issue of Grant Morrision's run:

I mean, don't get me wrong, you look beautiful, it's just that...it's not real is it? It's just your job to create a fantasy...you're not my girlfriend and all we're really sharing is some weird financial transaction which is helping you through college.

I know you probably have jeans and a sweater to change into backstage and a boyfriend back home. I can't fool myself that there's anything more to this.

Which I guess is the point huh? The people who frequent these places can fool themselves, can't they?

As far as otaku being taken advantage of by marketers...well I have Evangelion all on VHS, all on DVD, and the director's cut DVD's. When the platinum editions came out I refused to buy the series again.

Rikkisimons pointed out "that she's suffering the pain many of us feel when our favourite thing has finally reached the exploitation level." and yeah, I've been there. On a forum I used to frequent we invented a name to seperate the "trendy" otakus (the "narutards" if you will) from ourselves who got into the genre back when seeing the Dragonball movies meant finding a shady store with bootleg copies that were fansubed. We created the term "Noobtaku" the definition of which being "an anime fan that gets all their knowledge of anime from Cartoon Network"

I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make here. I used to call myself an otaku (I still call myself a fanboy) so I just felt the need to type down a reaction.

Sorry for the ramblings.

Really fascinating to read from a woman in the "home turf" of all that Moe crap. I wish there was more available in English!

I'm not a huge manga fan, so I can't really speak with any authority on the subject. I did always find the screaming, underage looking girls and tons of fluids in manga porn kind of squicky myself. If someone wants to speak up against that particular aspect of manga art, more power to'em.

If you're going to a strip club for reality, you're going for the wrong reasons. :P

Seriously, I believe that these types of places (strip clubs, maid cafes) simply cater to a need, and that need is attention, usually involving some form of fetish, be it a slinky sex pot or a girl in frills. As long as the attendees go in with the proper attitude, I don't see anything wrong with it as long as the customers and employees are willing participants. Once I figured that out, the places were a lot more fun. Hell, my wife and I still go to strip clubs with our friends (Though Hooters still doesn't make much sense to me. I must need to be a sports person...)

And as far as real otaku go, it's a good thing they do go to those places because I wouldn't wish them on a real person. Despite popular culture's belief, the love of a good woman (or man) isn't going to change these poor creatures until they actually want to change.

I'm not sure if it's call it being like Shatner's address. It sounds like a fan who is upset with the people who end up dragging down the various fandoms they participate in; even if she also works professionally in it, it seems to be more from the view of a fan.

Unfortunately, it's a kind of "damned if you do, damned if you don't". As long as fandoms remain on the fringe, they will attract fringe people, including the loli's, the shota's and the more extreme furries. But if it becomes popular, then we end up with wannabe's who are only in it for because they can be different like all their friends.

What is this Shatner "get a life" speech of which you speak? Was it like the scene in GalaxyQuest where the actor who played the captain ripped his fans a new one because they were obsessed with knowing more about the show he'd been in than he did?

It was a sketch done on SNL where after being asked the combination to a safe used in one of the episodes of Star Trek Shatner flies off and yells "Get a life! It was just a TV show! etc..."

Google is your friend.

I remember complaining about too many catgirls. I give up. I don't want to know what's going to rear it's ugly head once the Moe fad passes on.

The story has hit ANN:

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=24310&postdays=0&postorder=asc&topic_view=&start=0

I agree with her, though I wish she'd cut out some of the "being an otaku used to be cool before these guys came along" thing.

http://www.time.com/time/asia/covers/501050829/manga.html

And apparently she's quite the Conservative. This doesn't undercut her opinion though. Moe's quite creepy.

PS- This link was pointed out to me on the AnimeJump forum.

She still kicks superass for that speech though :)

Say No to Moe!

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